My guest today is a champagne geek, lavender farmer, and award-winning author of five books.
She has pursued decades of delicious research in the wine caves and cellars of France, Spain, Italy, Portugal, Argentina, and California. She is a champagne historian, tour guide, and champagne cocktail creator for Breathless Wines.
When my guest discovered the real-life stories of the Champagne Widows of France, she knew she’d dedicate years to telling the stories of these remarkable women who made champagne the worldwide phenomenon it is today. Her series of novels Champagne Widows meets her commitment to their stories. Welcome to Authors Over 50, Rebecca Rosenberg.
https://rebecca-rosenberg.com/
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Authors over 50 writing in life’s sweetest third authors over 50s weekly podcast celebrates writers and their Journeys to publication writing after 50 is a whole story on its own so let’s Skip To Life’s sweetest third and talk with authors about their Journey from pen to publish welcome I’m Julie daily
Your host and I invite you to listen to interviews with writers who’ve achieved their goal of publishing a book just later in life we’ve seen award list for under 30 or under 40 but I’ve yet to see list for those who’ve achieved a significant Milestone of their own
Launching a new career and Publishing their first book after the age of 50 we will hear about these authors Inspirations struggles strategies and the smell of that first book these writers Journeys inspire me because I’m one of them my guest today is a champagne geek lavender farmer an awardwinning author
Of Five Books she has pursued Decades of delicious research in the wine caves and sellers of France Spain Italy Portugal Argentina and California she is a shamp historian tour guide and champagne cocktail creator for breathless wines when my guest discovered the real life stories of the champagne widows of
France she knew she’d dedicate years to telling the stories of these remarkable women who made champagne the worldwide phenomena it is today her series of novels champagne widows meets her commitment to their stories welcome to authors over 50 Rebecca Rosenberg thank you Julia how fun to be here cheers everyone thank you
Rebecca our opening question on authors over 50 as always what took you so long to write your first book well I had a lavender business that took up all my time so we had the largest lavender producing company in America Amica and we had that for 20
Years and I live on a lavender farm here in Sonoma uh Vineyard country and we did we grew lavender because we knew we didn’t have enough acreage to grow grapes so lavender seemed like the perfect complement to that and once I started meeting all the lavender farms
Around the country and there are 300 different lavender Farms um they loved our products because we actually sewed and made candles and did all sorts of things did poies all sorts of things he Spa products once I started learning about the Lavender Fields around the
Country I knew I wanted to write a book about them because lavender as you probably know is so healing and so wonderful and has so many beneficial properties that I had to write a book and that was really the first time it um came to me that I would like to write
Even though I’ve been writing all my life so then I was hooked after that first one and kept going well then which came first Your Love of wine or learning about these champagne widows well I actually had a couple of books in between there so actually the
Champagne widows are my fourth and fifth books that I’ve written so I’ve always loved wine I have to admit from the time I was 21 and I always loved sparkling wine this one is the pomery wine which I just wrote a book about the woman who
Made that and then the first book was about V Cleo and you’ve probably seen that beautiful orange label around so I was really intrigued with sparkling wine specifically because it’s so hard to make it takes like twice as long to make and that’s why it’s so expensive so I
Thought about these people that really labor to create this wondrous thing called champagne well that’s just really fascinating and I want to hear just a snippet more about the champagne widows that you found out about and your inspiration for those books love to tell you so the first one we talked about
Is about vle Co and this is in 1800 which is a whole different world and she lived in the town of Ron which is in Champagne France and she actually knew um Napoleon so Napoleon plays a huge part in this book because Barbara Nicole Cleo was a very rich woman it turned out
But women had no rights at all to to own businesses or do any kind of business on their own or even work without their husband’s permission so she wanted to start a champagne house because actually the the segment that I’m going to read you is about why she had to start a
Champagne house but she wasn’t allowed to unless she had a husband who would agree to it so she ends up marrying her childhood sweetheart who she can kind of Boss around and they start this wonderful champagne business but unfortunately Napoleon uh engages in 15 years of wars
And so it was impossible for her to sell this champagne out of the country in fact it was illegal he made it illegal and uh she goes through quite a few Antics and some illegal activities to get her wine through his um Cod of ships that was guarding the French
Champagne because he knew champagne was what Russia wanted what all the countries loved coveted the French champagne and he wasn’t about to let anyone have it so it’s really about her battle with Napoleon and how she gets around him so it’s fun fun story in 1800s are you kidding that’s just crazy
It is crazy I I don’t know how those women were were so strong and became so powerful and and their legacy continues today in spite of of everything that they were having to live through as you said that I’m I’m struck with the fact that they had it so hard
That they had to really rise up out of themselves and do something extraordinary and a few women really did just like the the next book which is Madame pomy look at this beautiful artwork by the way the artwork on these covers are actual champagne posters that
They Ed to sell the champagne at the time like people have thought that this one was a um 1920s type of gal but it isn’t it’s from that era and so it’s an actual champagne po poster and I have more champagne widdows books coming out and so I will always feature a a
Beautiful poster but Madame pom’s story is almost the opposite she was 40 years old when she was widowed and she had never worked she was a volunteer who created an orphanage in a cathedral and she taught those orphans um etiquette the rule she taught them the rules and
The reason she did that is because would all go into Service as maids and cooks and all of that and they had to learn the rules and the fun part about this book is she learned that the rules got her nowhere that she had to break the
Rules in order to succeed so she was left a widow at 40 had to figure out what she wanted to do she had no experience at all and she decided she Not only would she make champagne but she would make the first dry champagne in the world called Brute and now brute
Is all we drink and so she actually revolutionized the way we drink champagne forever and of course all the men who were already making champagne wouldn’t help her out and told her her champagne tasted like razor blades going down your throat so I love you know her
Guts and her persistence and the way she was also so Madame pomy and Bo Cleo I just adored their stories and had to tell them I love that you found that Niche and and such fascinating stories and being able to share those with your readers and all of your books are they
Um were they published differently did you search for an agent uh use a hybrid a small press or did you self-publish from your first until your fifth I have a publisher I have two different Publishers and I’ve also self-published so I’ve done the gamut and the next book that I’m writing I
Will go through the whole thing of trying to find an agent and all of that which is very difficult process but I I have found that having a publisher is nice when I did that in my um first book that was publish was called The Secret
Life of Mrs London and I had the traditional publisher which was great because I didn’t know anything about how everything works but I found that when you have a publisher you don’t have the freedom to do a lot of things you know they own the rights in fact I have no
Rights to that book I can’t promote it I can’t do anything I can’t tell I look I look at the radio ings and see that it’s super high still like after six seven years um so they’re doing things with it but they don’t even tell you after a
While and so it’s a whole different thing and I really adore I did these books through my own publisher and what’s exciting about that is you have total um freedom to do what you need to do and want to do to make a beautiful product and i’ I’ve been designing
Products for our lavender business for 20 years so and before that I was in advertising and marketing so I love to create the whole thing and I’ll give you an example of publishing which is crazy my first book Mrs London The Secret Life of Mrs London won a prestigious national
Award and my publisher didn’t want that award and so they never used it it it’s a big award and it was a Gold Award and I was thrilled being my first published book and they didn’t want to use it they didn’t feel that they um fit in that
Category of that award and so they never used it it’s not on the book it’s nowhere and so that that is when I decided H I’m not sure I want to keep going this route but then it the decision was kind of made for me because the next book I
Wrote was set in 18 um70 and they did not the publisher wasn’t publishing books from the 19th century at all they only wanted 20th century historical fiction so I said H well I’ve been I had already been working on that book for a long time so I wasn’t going to let it
Die I loved it in fact I’m writing the sequel to it right now and it it won two gold Awards the book that they rejected uh won two gold Awards so I’m like okay I guess I’ll play my own game for a while and it’s fun and there are just so many options
That we have today that we didn’t a few years ago so I I think you can run the gamut of of however you want to publish and you can have a variety of those I’ve heard from so many authors who do who self-published and they have a a
Publishing house and they do what they want to so I love the freedom of that and and learning you know how to do all of that I think it just you know makes your journey stronger it is stronger although you know it takes a lot more work it’s got
To be double the work and the work is very different from each other you know to create a beautiful literary book is totally different than learning how to publish it and totally different from learning how to Market it so but you know I’m a business woman at heart so
It’s all good for me and that’s why I do well writing about women who Forge it their own path they give me courage when I get you know upset with it exactly that’s a great inspiration for all of us today and I’m so excited that you’re writing
About that that you get to travel all over the world to do research and you can write that off as a business expense I keep telling my husband that we led a tour through um champagne last year and he never wrote it off and I said we were
Leading the tour I planned it we did it and now after this meeting with you we’re planning another Cruise um with champagne so that’s exciting and yes you get I get to speak about champagne what’s so bad about that all yes that sounds very exciting and
And I would take those gold Awards and stick those stickers on all those books whether the publisher liked it or not because I do but you know they sell the book mostly so it it just goes nowhere oh well I know they’re there yes you have to put them on your website and
Know that people are going to see those because even a a less prestigious award we use those wherever we can so I would certainly be using those and talking about publicity have you had the challenges that most writers have because we like to be writing but
We don’t like to promote ourselves and I know you’re a businesswoman and used to promotion and I was in public relations and marketing myself but it’s a little different in this book industry have you found anything that works for you or maybe something you tried that didn’t work yes well
The best thing I could say to a self-published author or an author that’s with a small press is to join ibpa which is the international book ass or independent book publishing Association because they I have found that they have fantastic and real programs there will be a million people
At you all the time to spend your money promoting with this thing and that thing and the other thing but they’re for real and an example is when I promote when I go out and do their media outreach to your specific question for these books um for champagne I will get
50 inquiries from really topnotch media and I just sent another one out because October October 27th to be specific is world champagne day so you take this is an idea you find the issues or the commonalities in your books and you promote because people reporters are interested in what my readers will want
To know about and people that like champagne will want to know about world champagne day so what did I do send out a whole thing about these books and how they relate to Champagne day and we have a we have two events that are coming up that promote champagne day and they can
Even order the champagne and get a whole tasting menu and all that good stuff so find something in your books that relates to something that people want to read in the newspaper or in the media today and then go ahead and get on that media outreach list because it really
Works you are singing to the choir because I just taught a session at a writer um conference about that very thing about taking days during the month um that are national calendar days you know like like you talked about and promoting those and using them on your
Social media so I think that’s a great idea I I didn’t know there was a national champagne day but I’m I’m happy to know that now and and certainly your day to shine plus like along that line once you get that idea then you find out oh well
There’s also a Chardonnay day and there’s a there’s an American champagne day which is in December so I’ll be doing it again because the media is looking for fun things to talk about because the news is so Drey and awful so if we can brighten their day with
Something positive or a call cuse I have a friend who’s written a book about a disabled veteran well that is perfect for media so anything that you can figure out that relates to the news cycle absolutely it it really works and especially small newspapers are underst staffed and they will run your press
Release almost verbatim the story that you send them um for those days to celebrate those days thing that I have discovered though and for a little tip is if you have an event if you’re talking local media or if you’re talking National media if you
Have an event that people can go to to get more involved with that then that is even better because that’s a call to action and so that’s why we’re like in this case on October 5th we’re going to have a zoom and invite the the entire country to find out how they can
Celebrate champagne World champagne day which is later in the month and then we’re having a an event at a Performing Art Center where this one will be really fun where we’re having judges these are um certified judges of wine that and we’re doing a blind tasting
Of the sparkling wine notice this is my cover the sparkling wine versus real champagne so it’s a blind tasting so we already have sold a 100 tickets and I’m sure we haven’t even really started promoting it yet so that’s that’s the kind of exciting fun things that you can
You can do and I’ve done that with every book that I’ve done from lavender my lavender book we did lavender festivals and we had 5,000 people on our property wandering the lavender field so yes you and I come from the same background advertising and marketing it’s great and I’m I’m already
In my head having you in a streaming service and and on the History Channel with all of your books I can see those made into movies so from your mouth to God’s ears as they say were there any specific books or seminars or writing Retreats or groups
That you can share that might have improved your writing Journey now I’ve been through probably 15 years of major seminars and all that and I would say the ones that stand out to me are Donald Moss anything by Donald moss and that is M his things are fantastic and very
Inspirational and I’ve done week-long things with him a couple of those and any seminar I can do with him I would always do and I continue to do them and even now I took I have a favorite author who runs a um class that is over nine months
Writing your novel in nine months and here I’ve written six novels already but I wanted to do it just to keep me you know to keep me motivated and to keep me on track and it has really worked plus I wanted to learn to write faster because
I write like a book in two years and she she said nine months so I’ve done the nine months I’ve done the eight months and I’ve done the first draft and now I’m into my second draft so it does help me get it rolling quicker and then I did
Take if you have longer time and money then you can go to a university and take a course there and I went to Stanford University for a 2-year course that was a combination of inperson and online and I found it invaluable that was my first published book so it really gave me a
Professional um a professional polish to an idea you know so you we have ideas about books but people wonder I have lots of friends who want to write books and they can’t really make that hurdle take a long class take a this one that I’m taking now is called novel in nine
By Michelle Richmond and it’s fabulous for people who don’t know how to get started well that’s great advice and I too love coaches and classes and I even did Nano rimo you talk about trying to write fast yeah it almost did in I did a draft in
Nanoro big mous I know I know you know being an English major I always would write a few sentences and go back and edit those few sentences well in nanoro which uh is 50,000 words in the month of November for those of you who aren’t familiar with it you just have to
Get the words on paper every day and then you’ll have a mess to edit at the end and I do believe in that process that you need to get that whole down before you go back and do all that beautiful editing and word smithing and all that good
Stuff well talking about word smithing because you are certainly um an expert a master at that why don’t you tell us a little bit about the passages that you’ve brought to share today and then read so we can hear your tone and voice in your book lovely so I’m reading from Champagne
Widows and I am reading the moment it’s from the first um first scene but I’m just reading a three sentence passage it’s the moment that Barbara Nicole CCO discovers why she has to make champagne because she is a privileged girl who’s grown up in champagne and has
Wants for nothing lives in I’ve been to all of her properties I mean they had several and massive Vineyard already and her father was the biggest employer in town with a thousand people working at his wool factory and he was the mayor and he was on Napoleon’s board so why
Did this rich little girl decide that she needed to work and make a champagne Factory so this scene is where her grandm who’s very old Grand mer is French for grandmother and she’s very very old and she is trying to convince Barbara Nicole that she has a
Blessing that her mother calls a curse and it’s called Len the nose so that’s Len is French for the nose so uh grandm has taken her down into the criar where all the bottles are stored for wines underneath champagne and that’s true the whole town has 200 kilometers of these beautiful caves so
She’s taken her down in the caves and gr is ready to die just so you know so here we go gr places a bunch of grapes in my hands and brings it to my nose what comes to you well the grapes smell like ripening pears and maybe a hint of ha Thornberry
She chortles and replaces the grapes with another Bunch what about these drawing their Roma up to the top of my pallet I picture gypsies around a fire Smoky deep and complex grilled toast and coffee her next handful of grapes are sticky and soft the aroma so robust and
Delicious my tongue Longs for a taste these smell like chocolate covered cherries gr mer wheezes with a rasp and a rattle that scares me I yank off the blindfold grare are you okay you’re ready she slides a wooden box carved with Vineyards and women carrying basket of grapes on their heads
Inside lays a gold tasty bin a wine tasting Cup in a long heavy chain your great grandir nichas ruar use this cup to taste wine with the monks at Hopeville ABY just by smelling the grapes he could tell you the slope on the hill which they grew the exposure to
The Sun the minerals in the soil she closes her papery eyelids and inhales your grandpar was Len the nose he passed down his Special Gift To You There She Goes Again with her crazy Notions Maman says L is a curse Grand mer clucks her tongue your M did not inherit Len so she
Doesn’t understand it it’s a rare and precious gift smelling the hidden essence of things I look for I took it for granted and now it’s gone her wrinkled hands pick up the gold tast in and Christen my nose a prickling clusters in my sinuses like a powerful
Sneeze that won’t release I wish there was truth to Grand as ramblings it would explain so much about my finicky nature you are Len barbar Nicole she lifts the chain over my head and the cup Nestles above my breasts you must carry on grandar ruin Art’s gift holding her bandage head Gran kees
Incoherently the Lantern cast a monstrous shadow on the Creer wall her tasting game has become a nightmare let’s get you back to your room I try to walk her up the stairs but her legs give up lifting her birdlike body in my arms I carry her as she carried me as a child
Trying not to topple over into the crier promise me you’ll carry on Len she says my dear grandmother is dying in my arms and now I know Len is a curse promise me her eyelids flutter and close I won’t let you down grandar I whisper she feels suddenly light in my arms but
The gold taste ofin feels heavy so very heavy around my neck oh that’s a beautiful scene thank you and I want to show you as it relates to this so Barbara Nicole had the talent to smell all these different beautiful scents in wine and that’s what wine makers do to today
These are all the scents that just exist in Chardonnay and so when a real expert smells a Chardonnay they can tell you oh this one has Apple or pear or orange or whatever and it’s a wonderful gift that I don’t really possess but I think I’ve
Spent my life trying to possess so I do it vicariously through her that’s amazing to have that sense of smell it is this is a chart that they use for instance these are all you can’t really see it but this these are all the different scents in all the wines that
They can pick out and so she had that sense of being able to mix all the different grapes for the for a delicious wine and everybody that’s watching today has tasted terrible wine and great wine and that’s the difference is the talent of the cook you know the wine maker
Themselves that know knows how to mix that recipe do you complete all of your research before you begin writing your books or do you do it as you go along was there a lot written about these widows that you found I was lucky enough with Madame paly and champagne widows to work with
The historian and my next book in this series I’m working with the historian as well but that’s from 1800s and so they don’t know the things like especially with Madame pomery she the historian didn’t know most of the things that I would ask so then you start looking and looking and searching
And you know seeing what you can find out about the different people that worked with her and then you make a supposition for instance like how did ma Madame pomery who was very um older and not didn’t have a lot of money how was she able to sell all her wine to the
Nobleman of Scotland well I found out that she went to school in finishing school in London and that her friends were these Scottish Nobles well that was lucky and the winery never has said anything I’ll tell you a funny quick story is that a funny thing is that I
Wrote All of Madame pomy then I did that tour through champagne last year and I went to this beautiful art Nuvo Home gorgeous and it was where Madam pom’s assistant lived and I said how could he build This Magnificent Castle um and then I asked their
Historian about it and she said well of course Madame Pomer and Henry vaser had an affair for 30 years which is something I had actually asked pom and they did not admit to it they would not talk about it and that is that is um that’s funny and the same
Thing happened actually with the secret life of Mrs London which is about the love triangle between Houdini Jack London and his wife Jack London’s wife and the historians here won’t talk about that but I found her diary and discovered all the little details and that is so much fun when you find out
And that I love to do that finding out things that people don’t really know about the subject I love family secrets and I love those that people don’t want to talk about and like you said when you find one it’s just a jewel and you can include that in your historical fiction
Or creative non-fiction people are calling it now you can take a historical f figure and wrap her or him in in fiction and and let your imagination run wild it’s great Rebecca what does writing success look like to you personally well since we discussed all the different um ups and downs of
Publishing and not publishing and it doesn’t make money the way that you know my past businesses have made money so for me it’s about having something exciting to think about and work out every day and wouldn’t everybody like to have something they love to do and every
Morning I wake up this morning I woke up and before I even open my eyes I’m thinking okay what’s that next scene that I’m writing and how can I make I’m in the second draft now so I’m like how I don’t really love how I did that and
This is such an important scene how can I make it better how can I make it more exciting so it’s really clear and yet mysterious and exciting so that really excites me as a creative person to be able to create something on your own I totally agree I just had this
Conversation with my husband yesterday and he said you’re supposed to be retired and I think you’re working more hours than you ever did in your real job you know and I said you know we have to especially in our age group I I want to have something to want to wake up every
Morning and be excited about do does he want me to sit in front of the television all day and it’s it’s something that has a beginning and an end and then you can decide if you’re going to go on with the next one I have several books waiting in the wings and
They have to earn my attention because it’s something you know that you’re going to spend two years doing or a year doing and then you have to be talking about it and obviously you can tell I’m excited about the champagne story so you have to be excited about whatever it is you’re
Going to be talking about too and it has to be worthwhile like why do it if it’s not worthwhile and as always our last interview question is are writers over 50 are quite unique do you have advice for WR writers 50 and above yeah writing and that idea you have is not
Going to write itself um I have a lot of friends who want to write books they have such great stories and the only way to do it is to dedicate at least a couple of hours every day to it because if you don’t you lose the storyline I
Lose the energy of what is happening and I have to think now where was I and what did it mean and all the things you know this too where where something in the end has to be put in the beginning you know you will lose all that weaving so I
Think like the second draft you are weaving things I think of a loom that you’re taking that piece that’s three4 the way through and you have to make sure that you planted the seed in the beginning and that’s a very complicated process so you have to write at least
Two hours every day I think two or three hours to make that story come to life and then you will find that it gets easier and easier and don’t go back and edit your things especially for the first well don’t ever do it do passes do
Drafts I love the idea of drafting so I’m in my second draft and then I’ll be the third and the fourth and the fifth and you’ll know when it’s starting to really get that good that’s great advice for all of us today and I’m so happy you were here
With us because I can tell that you are as interesting and and complicated and fascinating as the women that you’re writing about and I think you’re just as bubbly as the champagne they created so I appreciate your being here and we’re excited to now count you among our authors over for
50 so much I had such a good time cheers cheers thank you for joining us today please look for authors over 50 every Thursday when we will have conversations with accomplished debut novelist over the age of 50 Please Subscribe and share with a friend and check out my own
Publication Journey after 50 at www. juliaa that’s d a i l y like daily newspaper.com until next time keep reading and writing and remember it’s never too late to fulfill a dream in life’s sweetest third